[NOTE: This Forum recap includes many gaps in the transcription where the recording was inaudible. These are marked with the time on the recording (e.g., [inaudible 27:49]) so that speakers may listen, fill-in-the blanks, and return the missing words for the recap records. Thank you for your assistance.]
Denise Davis – Forum Moderator
Good morning, Forum. I’m Denise Davis your moderator. Ronda Tycer is our Forum recap editor. And John Crockett is our tech guru. As a reminder, our meeting is being recorded. Before you begin speaking, please state your name. While speaking, be respectful. Personal attacks will not be tolerated. For those online, if you’d like to share URLs, post them in the Chat Box and they’ll be included in the meeting recap. We partner with IVCB Community 1s.t.org and IVCBA.org to get information out. So be sure to visit their websites and sign up for their newsletters. To sign up for our Forum meeting notices and recaps, send an email to us at ivcbcommunityforum@gmail.com.
Mr. Crockett, is Kari here? Sorry I can’t see those online. (Kari, your connection is bad again.) I’ll give a couple of IVGID highlights. This weekend there will be free tennis and pickleball at the IVGID Tennis Center. So go to IVGID.org to find out more information about that. There were a couple of golf emails. So check in on the golf tab on the IVGID website. The next Board of Trustees meeting is July 27. The agenda is not posted yet. It’s usually up about 7 days before the meeting. Tia, do you have announcements from the Fire Department?
Tia Rancourt – North Lake Tahoe Fire Protection District Information Officer
Just a reminder—and to thank everyone to adhere to the summer fire restrictions in place. It’s going well and we just want to say thanks to everybody and our agency supporters, and for everybody just being great about no wood or charcoal burning. So thanks everybody.
John Crockett – Washoe County Library Head Librarian
There is nothing major going on at the library. Tuesday our monthly book club meets— “Inclined to Read.” It’s the 3rd Tuesday morning of the month. It’s been nice and busy here at the library.
Denise Davis
I don’t see Jeff from TRPA. If anyone wants a magnet with the Washoe County Sheriff Office (WCSO) non-emergency phone number on it, we have those. It’s in microscopic font. It’s not just your eyes. If you’d like information about what’s going on with road construction, go to inclinehighways.com. For this coming week, they’ll be working at the Marlette project on Highway 28 Monday-Friday, 7am-5pm. On Fridays they quit at noon. They’re expecting that project to be done by the end of July. On Mt Rose Highway, they’ll be working Monday-Friday 3am to 5pm. and Fridays 3am to noon.
The next announcement is for the Community Emergency Response Team (CERT). If you want to learn to handle emergencies for yourself or your neighbors or your community, CERT —which is through the Washoe County Sheriff Office (WCSO)— will have a training session here in July. If you’d like more information about that, you get free training and materials. And then if you want to help in your community – you might have seen us working at the 4th of July parade with our CERT hats on directing traffic. So if you’d like to find out more about that, I’ll put that information in the recap.
Don’t forget the non-emergency WCSO dispatch number is 775 785-9276.
Also, a few weeks ago, we had a presentation from Chief Lindgren from the Zephyr Cove Fire Department. They are raising funds for a helicopter for the Tahoe Basin – and would like to get two. They would be stationed permanently in the Basin and not off fighting other fires. So if you’d like to contribute, please look that up online.
On July 21st, there is a Tahoe Regional Planning Agency (TRPA) Hearings Officer meeting at 2pm. On July 27, the Governing Board will meet but the agenda is not posted yet.
The Board of County Commissioners (BCC) has an online test project in Incline where you can go online to see a live map and find out what’s going on with various construction projects. The next BCC meeting will be Tuesday July 19. They will have no meeting the following Tuesday but instead a Special Meeting Friday July 22 with the City of Reno, City of Sparks, and the County. On the agenda for the July 19th meeting are two Incline items: 1 – an agreement with an employee Cody Burt to occupy a residence at the 625 B Mt Rose Highway, which is County property.
– They will be approving the Reno Transportation Commission (RTC) grant to IVGID for $17,000 to reimburse for transportation of seniors and disabled citizens.
The Tahoe Transportation District (TTD) will have a committee Board meeting on August 3, and the IV Mobility Committee—which is not the same as the Mobility Hub committee—will be meeting Monday July 25. The Survey for the County Mobility study has been extended to July 22nd. If you have anything to say about traffic, parking, bicycles, or pedestrians—please go online to their survey and share your comments. There is a Spanish survey available. The official title of it is: Tahoe Transportation Plan Online Survey. The URL will be in the Forum recap.
More Washoe County business… We have an opening on the Citizen Advisory Board (CAB), which operates under the County. One of our CAB members moved up to the Board of Adjustment, so we have an opening for an alternate. We meet once a month on the first Monday night of the month. The next meeting is August 1st. This is online only. Find the meeting information on the washoecounty.gov website.
I want to update everyone on the Justice Court. At the June 28 meeting of the BCC, they approved funds to renovate the old library building next door to serve as the Justice Court. The BCC authorized $747,800 of America Rescue Plan Act (ARPA) funds. In the documentation they specifically say that the Incline Justice Court renovations will allow a temporary use for the Court to occupy the space for a short-term duration of 3-5 years. So our Justice Court just got a bit of an extended life. If you’re not aware, there’s been an effort to get the Court moved down to Reno with the other District courts. We spoke out against that quite a bit lately. Just know that the issue will cycle back.
Washoe County is now offering a Leadership Academy. To learn more go to the County website.
I want to make everyone aware that the 2022 Lake Tahoe Summit will be August 16th at Sand Harbor. It will be hosted by US Senator from Nevada, Jackie Rosen. Information about that can be found online, and the URL will be in the Forum recap.
TRPA will hold a meeting July 27 at which they will be discussing the recent housing study. There’s also a Hearing Officer meeting July 21st, which is to approve a Temporary Use Permit for a school at the St. Francis church.
We just learned that there is a meeting going on today. Because the NV legislation meets only every-other year, they have interim committee meetings. We learned there is a Legislative Committee for Review and Oversight of TRPA and the Marlette Lake Water System. Today one of their agenda items is to identify key transportation priorities for the Lake Tahoe Basin. The TRPA and the TTD have a lovely presentation laid out for them. I’m sure you might be interested in looking at it to see what they think our issues are. So that’s a group we’ll be following up on. That committee is composed of 6 elected officials – 3 from the NV State Assembly and 3 from the NV State Senate. Three of the 6 people on the Board are from Clark County. There’s Lisa Krasner who is currently our Assembly Representative. And there is a woman who is the Assembly Representative from Sparks (I forgot her name), and then James Settlemeyer who is the NV State Senator from Douglas County. They are the locals on that committee. So that’s a group we didn’t know about until last week. We’ll be following up and letting you know what they’re up to.
Sara Schmitz – Incline Village General Improvement District Trustee, IVCB Community 1st Director
I just want to clarify that at their upcoming meeting, the County Commissioners will be removing the Consent Item related to transportation funding because they never identified the agency that would be receiving the funding. When I inquired, there was confusion about what agency would receive the $17,000 for senior transportation here in Incline Village. So that agenda item will be removed, and after clarifying the agency that will receive the funds, they’ll put it back on the agenda.
Kathie Julian – Incline Village Resident, Washoe County Board of Adjustment Member
What steps are being taken to get that Washoe Transportation Survey link out to our Latino residents in the apartments, because they are the more likely people who would need that? Is there anything being done there?
Denise Davis
Contact Amy Commings at Parametrix.
Kathie Julian
Okay, thank you.
Denise Davis
We have a request from our regular attender Steve Dolan – fish and wildlife enthusiast.
Steve Dolan – Incline Resident, Friends of 3rd Creek Director
I thought everybody would like to see this video from 2 weeks ago. It’s in the Incline Village Crystal Bay (IVCB) watershed. This is our new permanent resident. He arrived sometime last spring. He’s about 45 lbs. He’s a 2-year-old male in search of a mate. That is a really good sign of the growing vitality of the 3rd Creek area. All beavers become our stewards. They’re helping the wildlife in terms of water storage and water tables. They are the wilderness firefighters because they moisturize the entire area and create meadows that don’t burn. They are water quality engineers who help filter out the fine particulate matter that we find to be the largest problem with our lake clarity. So he’s a wetlands manager too. So he’s got a lot of jobs. He’s really valuable for the community. And it was great to find him. It’s the first time in 30 years I’ve seen a beaver in our watershed. I hike it early and throughout the year. If you run across him, respect him, and take care. Thank you. [See Steve Dolan’s input at the end of the recap.]
[Anonymous]
Did you name him?
Steve Dolan
I like “Beaver Bob.” But if you want to name him, give us a name.
Denise Davis
Do you want to report on how far up the creek we had fish this spring?
Steve Dolan
The spawning Rainbow trout move up the stream into the golf course from time to time. That’s kind of a regular thing. There’s nothing unusual to my knowledge about their spawning habits this year. They’re called wild because they are not native, but they are the fish we are studying because they are closest to the Lahontan Cutthroat trout. By the way, the US Forest Service has recently recognized that 3rd creek itself is the only creek on the lake registered as a Lahontan habitat. That’s because of Washoe tribal records from 1880. The genetic diversity professor from University of Nevada Reno (UNR) has found that 3rd Creek and Incline Creek are the two most genetically diverse creeks on the lake. Just so you know, 3rd Creek is one of our special creeks, which is why the NV State is doing the survey of the trout and spawning habits. Thanks for letting me say this. [See Dolan attachment at the end of the recap.]
Denise Davis
Thanks for sharing about Beaver Bob, and keep us updated on our fish.
Joe Farrell – Incline Village Resident, Pulse Point Board of Directors
I just have a quick question for Steve. I had my grandsons at the Burnt Cedar cove area on 4th of July and there was a lot of algae. I just wonder if there’s an update on the algae bloom you reported on last month.
Steve Dolan
The algae program that Friends of 3rd Creek has been working on ends today. However UC Davis has a public program that’s ongoing throughout the lake. That algae bloom was non-toxic. But it was a great fire drill for the town. However we were warned to keep an eye out for toxic blooms. They will be coming. They’ve already started on the South Shore. The US Forest Service has given notice to people around Taylor Creek. The good news is that our bloom and the one Ronda sent to me regarding the Northwest corner of the lake are non-toxic blooms. In fact some of that remains in Burnt Cedar cove. But it’s not toxic and it’s growing. It didn’t get pushed out by the waves that grace our Incline Beach from time-to-time and keep that water fresh. With the warming of the lake—when it gets up to 70—we should be particular in what we look for on our lakeshore.
Barry Bale – Incline Village Resident
I live on Incline Creek. Part of the Creek goes through my property. And my grandkids and I are constantly finding fishing lures along the Creek. Is it legal to fish Incline Creek?
Steve Dolan
No. The two creeks that it’s illegal to fish in are Incline Creek and 3rd Creek.
Incline and 3rd are illegal. 3rd Creek can be fished above Highway 431 right where the Fire Station is up there.
Barry Bale
If it’s illegal to fish in there, who do you report them to?
Steve Dolan
You can report them to the NV Department of Wildlife Fisheries. A gentleman named Sam is running the program here in Incline right now, and is in charge of this watershed. Also Travis Hawks with the US Forest Service is who you could call. He’s Sam’s advisor and has been working in Incline for a long time. I have to say if adults are fishing the creeks they can get their poles broken. If kids are doing it, we’ll just say, “Go fish where it’s legal.” There won’t be a big deal made about it. It’s just about respecting the rules. But up where you live, you’ll find some of those tagged large Rainbow trout that are in for spawning purposes. Some get trapped with the water flow changing, and some get back to the lake. Most go back to the lake.
Jacquie Chandler – Incline Village Resident, Sustain Tahoe Director
I want to support what Steve is doing and thank him for all the work. This is very exciting about the beaver. It is a healthy sign. My “ask” is for all of us in the community—the beavers have had really a hard time trying to survive in Tahoe. You may or may not know they exterminated them on Snow Creek and they are constantly harassing them down at Taylor Creek. So anything you can do… If you see people near a creek where there’s wildlife, remind people to give wildlife a chance. Back off. This beaver is precious. We hope he can come back. They are tremendous. I put a link in the Chat about them called “Leave it to Beavers.” It’s fabulous to learn how they can they shut down wildfires. They have so much restorative engineering ability. So I hope we celebrate the beaver and do what we can to steward our visitors to help.
Andy Whyman, MD – Incline Village Resident, IVCB Community Forum Moderator Emeritus
I just want to publicly thank Todd Lowe and his magnificent crew for the work they did on the taxation issue. And I’m looking forward to see how the City of Incline Village issue comes about.
Denise Davis
All right. Well, with that lead-in, Todd Lowe has joined us today to talk about the efforts toward the City of Incline.
26:05
Todd Lowe – Village League to Save Incline Assets President
For 31 years my wife and I have lived here and hiked the trails, and we’ve seen all the signs of the beavers, but never seen one. This is the first time… seeing Bob.
Good morning. And thank you Denise, Ronda, and John for making it possible to talk to you about this new piece of business. We’ve already had a tremendous response to our soft launch. A lot of people have come to our website. If you haven’t done so, you should—and put your name in so you can stay apprised of what’s going on. Go to the website: www.cityofinclinevillage.com. I also want to thank all the people who have already volunteered. There are so many, that we’re having a tough time getting our arms around it, but you can anticipate we will reach out and meet with you and talk about how you can make a difference. So speaking of volunteers, we already have two in the room. One of them is John here who has volunteered to write an article about us to be published someplace. And the other is sitting in the back of the room—who should come up—Kevin Lyons. He needs no introduction. He’s on the CAB. He’s got 28 years of studying government, helping cities around the United States of America with “best practices.”[inaudible 27:49] . Just in case you don’t know about the Village League, I’d like to give you an update on our old business before I go on to our new business.
Many know the Village League was formed by Maryann Ingemanson over 20 years ago. We have had multiple projects. Probably the one that most residents know is the tax revolt. The reason I got involved with that was one day in 2002 near Burnt Cedar Beach there was a commotion. I was out in my dinghy rowing around. And there was Maryanne Ingemanson and Ted Harris dressed in Colonial garb a la the Boston Tea Party. They were tossing tea into the lake. And I thought that was pretty interesting. I could support that because we were being overtaxed by Washoe County.
Just so you know, as of today, we have helped return over $100 million to property owners here in Incline Village. As a quick update on the old business, of the latest tranche, which is $56 million, about $28 million has been sent to 4300 folks. That’s about half of it.
Unlike back in 2012 we had another $45 or $46 million come out, there were 3000 people who didn’t get their refunds because of the way the County handled it. Now I’m happy to report there are only 12 people out of 9000 who are not identified. So we can anticipate that if you want it, it will come. Now, even if you haven’t gotten a refund because you didn’t live here in 2002-2003-2004 and 2005, I think it’s important for you to realize there’s still a huge benefit to you from that Initiative. At the time, Washoe County raised our assessment levels to a level that would cause… 213%. So at that time we were paying tax rates that no one else in Nevada was paying for another 35 years. So back then— instead of paying taxes we’d all be paying until 2038—we got assessment values reset. And that affects everyone. As you know, in Nevada, when you sell a property – the tax rate is not reset. You inherit whatever the previous valuation is. So that’s worth about $300 million over that period of time. So we’re $400 million better off. These are the kinds of numbers that [inaudible 31:14] Village League. Part of this—at the top of the list—we hope—is that those monies saved will come back to the community to make it a better place to live.
So this was billed as a “Come listen to Todd Lowe answer your questions about incorporating Incline Village.” But really what I want to do is—and we will answer your questions—[Kevin Lyon – I’ll take notes.]—but, what I really want to do is listen—listen to what you have to say and what your concerns are and what your issues might be to establishing a government in Incline Village and Crystal Bay.
We’re going to take notes. I’ve got my pencil and pen here. I’m looking at the clock. And I feel we may have more questions than we can answer, but we will write them all down and we will answer each and every one of them on the website. So anything we don’t get to—I guess you can type things into the Chat Box—we will publish the best answers we can come up with.
Denise Davis
So just a reminder if you’re here in person and you have a question, we really need for you to come up by the microphone so everyone can hear you.
Jacquie Chandler
I was part of the Washoe County Nuisance Committee back in the early 2000s, and it was shockingly clear how problematic it is to have County regulations that work in South County—where it’s okay to have 6 abandoned cars in your front yard —applied to Incline. There is no way we could come up with rules that could work across the board. We’ve seen this on parking and all kinds of things. That being said, and I was here when we tried to do a city before, so I remember that and I thought it was a good thing. I’m wondering if this would make it so our rules could be different from Washoe County and other parts of the County that do not have the sensitive ecosystem that we have – if that would be solved by being a city. Because if it isn’t and the County still overrides – my thought is why can’t we have Tahoe County. And everything inside the Basin is one county? I know that’s a bigger ask but it is so problematic to have rules that are the same for this incredibly unique ecosystem and anything outside the Basin. That’s my question and comment, thank you.
Todd Lowe
So is the short version of the question, “Why can’t we be Tahoe County?”
Jacquie Chandler
It’s two things. Would becoming a city be able to separate us so we could have regulations that are appropriate for this ecosystem and this area separate from what is being done over there? Then a city would solve it. If not, because the County seems to override cities, if it wouldn’t solve some of the problems we’re having being tied to the County, then I wonder and suggest why can’t we have Tahoe County, which would be everybody inside the Basin? Which is a bigger ask. I don’t know if you could split a County. It’s so problematic with trying to have one law for what is happening here and another for what is happening down in every other part of Washoe.
Todd Lowe
So that is a great pair of questions and an important concern. To the extent that it’s pretty deep in the weeds of our own stuff, I’m going to have Kevin stand up and respond.
Kevin Lyons – Incline Village Resident, Citizen Advisory Board Co-Chair, Flashvote
I wrote that down as two questions. Could our rules be different from Washoe County? The answer is yes. That’s one of the challenges. And we see this on the CAB actually a bunch of times. ”Why do we have to have the same regulations as all the rest of Washoe County?” Which is a perfectly good government rule. But our needs are very different than the rest of Washoe County. Not just things like zoning and planning and ecosystem, but snow plowing.
The second question was, “Could we be Tahoe County? We can but we don’t need to be. Of course we looked at being a county but the big difference between being a county and a city is that to be a county you need to depend on the kindness of strangers, which means you need the Legislature to become a county. And with the general-law city approach, we can do it ourselves. We can sign our own petition, we can approve it, and it has to happen. It’s a big difference.
Todd Lowe
Part of the distinction is that we’re in full control. If we wanted, we can push the button. The County could even object or lobby against it—and they very well may do so—I would hope not. But if we want it, it’s ours.
Aaron Vanderpool – Incline Village Resident
I want to start off by saying I kind of like the idea of incorporating as a city. We clearly have a lot of issues, and this seems like this could be a good way to fix them. When I think about it I can kind of think of the potential for making things worse though. So with my question, I want to play devil’s advocate here. And so because there are so many wealthy people here in town and because there are so many people who own multiple parcels, and also because there are so many people where this might be their second, third, or fourth, or more home; and because there are fewer and fewer people who live and work here, what’s to stop the corruption from just taking over our Incline City government and making things even worse, on an accelerated path to inequality? Is there a way we can ensure representation from the lowest income areas of town so they aren’t just being oppressed and driven out of town even faster? And then kind of to what Jacquie was saying, like if we can make our own rules, that sounds like potentially it could be more oppressive as well if things went down that pathway – kind of like an overbearing and overreaching HOA. So that’s just my comments out there.
Todd Lowe
Right. Well those are real concerns. And everyone probably has in the back of his or her mind some fear or paranoia about that kind of thing. It could happen anywhere in any government in the world. What we’re trying to do here is to do the very best thing that is scoped for our community. As I mentioned, for example, by relying on resources and state-of-the art government practices, we think we can be better. We can make Incline the best city in this country, and also, the best run city in the country. We’re willing to put in the effort to bring that opportunity to endorse that. If you don’t want to do it, just say so, and it doesn’t happen. We’re not going to do anything to Incline Village. We’re going to make an opportunity, and, in fact, after making that opportunity, we’re going to step aside and see what [inaudible 39:40]. It’s going to be your choice.
And in the same way that we can incorporate as a city, and we’re making a commitment to it—let’s say it all goes bad—you can also dis-incorporate. It’s a little easier than incorporating, but you can do that too. So if for any reason this doesn’t pan out—and I think you realize that the Village League is playing the long game. It took us 20 years to do this tax refund. So if it doesn’t pan out, we can dis-incorporate and go back to where we were. I’m pretty sure the colonists didn’t say to King George, “Well, we’ll come back and join you if it doesn’t pan out.” So, I do think this is probably a one-way process. And we just have to do the best job we can. First, listening and making sure we’re actually solving problems—and that we design and build something that works and you can support. If we don’t do that then shame on us and don’t support it and let’s not go forward. But we’re willing to try. And based on the amount of interest we’ve had – and the number of volunteers who’ve raised their hands—there’s a lot of people who thinks this is good.
Kevin Lyons
I just have one little thing to add on to that concern. The multiple-parcel ownerships is one concern. So in an HOA, votes do typically go on the number of parcels, or get scaled by square footage. [inaudible 41:12] We’re not an HOA. We’re a government, so it’s a 1 person-1 vote. And that’s voting residents. So first you actually have to live here and be a resident of Incline Village for voting. And really, more importantly, when you think about a government, it needs to serve the whole no matter who voted for the people in office.
There is a common public misperception that if, “Hey, I get elected by District 1 of the city, I serve District 1.” No. You get picked by the voters in District 1. By the way, you can also run unopposed and win by appointment. You can win by a coin flip actually. That’s how ties are broken in cities. And historically in Athens, you used to win by a lottery. That was how we picked our elected officials, and I’ve heard people say I wish we were doing that today. But the end result of all that is that the moment you take the job—and good governments do this—the shift from campaigning to governing is abrupt. So it doesn’t matter what I promised people, or what my supporters thought I would do, or the kind of deals that might be rumored– you have one job and one job only, and that’s to make sure the government is serving the public as a whole at all times. So that’s the methodology and the mission of any city.
Steve Dolan
May I make one correction? I think in Nevada we draw for high card.
Kevin Lyons
You are actually right, I believe. It’s a Nevada thing. So the randomness holds in Nevada, but the card draw is very specific to Nevada.
Cliff Dobler – Incline Village Resident
Getting back to Kevin’s statement, you said that if you wanted to form a county, you’d have to go through the Legislature, however if we want to be a city we can do whatever we want. But there still has to be statutes of things that you have to do to qualify. And what I’m saying is… A bunch of people get up in the morning and say “let’s be a city.” Okay. But I haven’t heard yet really what benefits do you think you can achieve by being a city over what the County is giving you, number 1; and number 2, a true review of what are the tripping stones to be able to get from point A to actually what you do to become a city.
Todd Lowe
If we’re not solving the problems, we’re wasting our time. I can tell you in summary the kinds of things we’re hearing about the problems. But I’m really more interested in hearing what you think are the problems with respect to government related to Washoe County that exist today. I’ve heard a few things already in this meeting. So the things we hear sound like this:
– Our voices are being ignored. There are a lot of specifics.
– We have stuff being done to us, rather than for us.
– There has been a precipitous reduction in services over the years. Remember when you could get a Building Permit here or a Driver’s License? I just heard something about the Justice Court going away. The Constable has already been stolen from us.
– We have problems that are not resolved. Some may never be resolved. And if they are, it seems they are being resolved slowly.
– We have some opportunities. We can make this place more, better, and different, but Washoe County will just never go there.
We have among ourselves enough resources. I just described that this community is $400 million richer than it would have otherwise been if we didn’t do what we did. So no one can tell me that we don’t have the resources to get something done here if we want it collectively. We have the talent here too. We have some really, really talented folks—all these people who have been volunteering. It’s like the best of the best.
Cliff Dobler
I have a process question. At what point in time… Somebody’s leading the group. Somebody’s got a committee, I assume that you’re going to bring people together. When are you going to come up with the plan, the actual plan? Here’s what we think we need to do. Here are the resources we’re getting through the County. Here are the resources coming back from the County. This is what’s going to stay with the County. And this is the pot that’s left over. And here’s what we think we can do with that. What’s the timeline? And what’s the vision?
Todd Lowe
I see you’re signing up for the committee. [Laughter]
Cliff Dobler
It sounds like a volunteer, right. I’m outspoken, but pretty good with numbers.
Kevin Lyons
So on that process, NRS266 [inaudible 47:29]. So there’s two types of city you can do. Just like the county is a legislative act, there’s a Special Charter city that requires legislative action. That’s one way to go. And for the same reason—even though a county would be better in some ways—it’s out of our control – which steers us back to the General Law city. Under 266 a General Law city has a series of steps and timelines with maximum times so people can’t drag their feet on things like reports or hearings or stuff.
So Step 1 is a petition. And the legal form of the petition is a description of the area (boundaries) and a plan for providing certain services as specified in 266. It’s like water, sewer, police, fire, and stuff like that. So that is the next step—timing to be determined. That petition in our case needs to have about 3000 signatures based on just under 9000 registered voters because you need a third of the electors in the area defined by the boundaries.
Once that happens, the clock starts, so you have 90 days to gather those petition signatures. If we’re lucky everything is going smoothly. We have volunteers who could potentially start later this summer. But we don’t have to. It could also be next spring – or next year.
The plan itself has to be created and developed. There’s a conversation this afternoon with a petition-lawyer specialist on some of those details to make sure you dot all the i’s and cross all the t’s. Because once that petition goes to the county, the petition and the signatures themselves will be evaluated for checking the boxes. Once it checks the boxes, at that point they have to schedule an election to vote on the city. And there is a timeframe for that. Reports have to go out and come back. There’s a hearing they have to have. And these things are typically like 30 to 60 day time-chunks each up to a maximum. At the end of that they issue an opinion. They can issue whatever opinion they want. The election happens. If it’s successful, the next step is actually an election for the first elected city officials. After that, the next July 1st basically is the date that you turn the switch, and services over here going to Washoe County that are in the Plan are moved over here along with the costs for running those services.
Cliff Dobler
So what’s the realistic timeframe for the Plan? I don’t think you can get a petition going unless everybody knows what they’re signing.
Todd Lowe
As Kevin said we’re meeting with the Petition lawyer today to get that petition development process going. And as I described, we are in discovery mode – what should be in the plan? What should be out? One of the first decisions we have to make is what are the boundaries of Incline Village. Do you want to stop at Rocky Point’s last house, or do you want it to go all the way past Sand Harbor down to Carson City/County? I can tell you that people from Montreaux are calling us and saying, “Take us too!” We’re not planning that. I’m just saying there are some decisions to be made—big important decisions. Not what suits us.
Kevin Lyons
They’ve got to suit the community as a whole.
Denise Davis
So the quick answer is there is no Plan yet, we’re still in the preliminary discovery phase.
Todd Lowe
Absolutely. And anything is possible. Please don’t make any conclusions or assumptions about the end point– because we haven’t determined what it is. It does look a lot like becoming an incorporated city.
John Crockett
Folks that have questions, please hang on one moment. We do have a couple online and Denise will determine the order.
Jill Brandin – Incline Village Resident
Is there a legal committee to investigate the effects on open-space deeds around the village and the Beach deed?
Todd Lowe
So is there a legal committee? Not today. Is there a lawyer? Yes. Is there a law firm? Yes. With respect to the Beach deed, this is not something we’re going to damage or disrupt. We have written and proposed to get approved Memorandums of Understanding (MOUs) that have gone through all the Trustees at IVGID, and Indra and Ryan. This is not a surprise to them. And they are more than happy to connect with us so we don’t step on something that shouldn’t be stepped on. I’m anticipating the IVGID Board of Trustees, hopefully soon, will give their commitment to work with us so wherever we’re going, we get there smoothly, without undue disruption, and robustly, and not sacrifice something precious to us such as the Beach deed.
That might mean bringing in more legal resources. But we will buy those resources and make sure they are applied. We’ll do the best job we can. We’re not in a hurry. We’d
rather do it right than fast.
Joe Farrell
Todd, thank you for your leadership on this. You have a great track record. I urge people to get on your website. There are a lot of questions and answers about taxation, the process, fire protection, and things of that sort.
Also I’ll share a quick story. My wife and I were residents in Castro Valley, California back in the 1980s to mid-90s. That community is unincorporated run by Alameda County, which the representation is somewhat [inaudible 54:37]. We have a similar situation in that Washoe County runs us. I lived in a community that was an unincorporated nightmare. You do not want to go to Castro Valley. The crime is rampant. We were unable to prevent BART from coming in, so when BART came in, as predicted, in 1994 the crime rate shot up like you wouldn’t believe. Fortunately we don’t have a crime-rate problem, but we have a control problem. We have all types of issues –short-term rentals, the transportation hub, etc. etc. I compliment you for what you’re doing.
There’s also a move in the Bay Area called ABAG, which stands for “All Bay Area Government.” That organization wants to force all communities in the SF Bay Area under one government. They tie it to Federal dollars in terms of highways, Section 8 houses, etc. It is a nightmare. I lived in Danville, California for 25 years. One of the reasons I moved to Danville, from Castro Valley, was because it has a government and it was run efficiently. So my comment is, “Hey, there are people on the Washoe county Board of Commissioners that are ABAG type individuals.” That’s why I am very, very in favor of a city. Thank you, Todd.
Todd Lowe
This is about local control. We may not always agree with each other, but at least it’s us. We don’t have to get in our cars and drive to Reno and convince someone else to see it our way. We just do [inaudible 56:25].
Chris Wood – Incline Village Resident, Citizen Advisory Board Member
Thank you Denise, and thank you Todd and Kevin for your presentation. Before I sign a petition, I want to know what impact this plan for an incorporated city will have on property taxes. And I’d also like to know the answer— before I sign the petition – to the question posed by the young man earlier. How is this city going to prevent driving out low-income people from this new community?
Todd Lowe
Property taxes are something I know a little bit about. (laughter) So first of all, do not sign a petition if the creators of the petition haven’t told you in great detail what ramifications it will have. There are some things we can say right now, but it’s not the last word because we haven’t made the detailed budget. We haven’t decided what services are in or out. There are some laws about property taxes that Kevin can educate us about [inaudible 57:49].
Kevin Lyons
So I had two questions on the impact on property taxes and one on how to prevent driving out lower-income people. One of the things—let me do a speed wrap [inaudible 58:02] wish list. One of the things we’ve heard, probably more than anything else was complaints about the range of housing options and the effects not only on people who used to be able to live here and have moved, but also on businesses. People can’t hire employees, and restaurants are closing, the Village Market closed, and there are a lot of examples like that. A lot of those problems are caused or exacerbated by TRPA. But at recent CAB meetings it’s very encouraging to hear that TRPA has recognized that problem – and actually apparently now has an orientation to deferring to local communities and local governments to manage some of those issues better. So that’s really promising on the lower-income issue. But you have to have a local government and have to have a seat at the table of course, and have the ability to take on some of those things. They actually have a mandate to increase housing units and make them more affordable units, All California cities have to show a plan to build extra housing. So that’s why it’s at the top of their mind now.
The second question was the effect on property taxes. So in Nevada— and this is in our website Frequently Asked Questions (FAQ)—there’s a law that if you create a new government, and that government takes over services that are transferred from another government, you can’t increase property taxes in the year that the transfer occurs. So in other words, you can’t use that as a loophole to increase taxes. So that makes sense in the year that a new government takes over. The costs of those services transfer over to the new government. After that—or even in that first year– they can go up or down depending on matching the needs of the community—what they’re willing to pay for, and what level of service they get. But in terms of the services taken over from Washoe County, that transfers with the cost of services [inaudible 59:58].
Todd Lowe
So is that clear? The County is required to give us the money that they were otherwise spending on our services. The difference is we manage it. We choose how they’re done, who does them, and we control the cost. But whatever it was before, we get.
Cliff Dobler
I understand that but you do or you don’t have the ability to continue to raise taxes after you incorporate?
Todd Lowe
Yes, you do.
Kevin Lyons
It’s interesting. A lot of local governments seem to act like, “Hey, property values went up so our budget went up.” But that’s weird. The budget should be tied to what you’re actually doing for your residents. And so what good governments do is if there’s a big jump up in assessed values, they lower the rates. Because the amount of money they need didn’t go up by, say 30% that our housing went up last year, even if 10% is inflation. So figure out the needs, build the budget, then decide what services should be.
Denise Davis
In the FAQs you put that for the 1st year the property taxes are basically frozen. After that we adjust up or down depending on the need. [Todd Lowe – They’ll go down.]
So we had a question in the Chat Box. Do you want to read that John?
John Crockett
Yes, this is from Dr. Myles Riner. How do you respond to residents who have expressed concern about adding another layer of government to the current County and IVGID governments?
Kevin Lyons
That’s a great question.
Todd Lowe
I think we’re going to get that one a lot.
Kevin Lyons
Well, it has come up a lot already, because it’s a metaphor that sounds right. And there is some aspect to that where there is potential for duplication of roles. And so it’s TBD – “to be determined.” But actually, when you think about a County government transitioning to the City, governments aren’t that complicated. There are about three- dozen services they might do. It’s like a menu. Right now Washoe County is doing all of ours except for water, sewer, trash, recreation, and fire. We have Special Districts doing those. So what you’re really doing is taking off a chunk of that menu and moving it sideways, actually operating in parallel. Historically, it tends to be one of the benefits in the US of having these non-overlapping or sometimes functionally overlapping jurisdictions for better competition in comparison. The short answer is it’s a new government, more officials to vote for, there could be some duplication at least initially, the services, though, are sideways, in parallel. Do you get the visual on that?
Bill Echols
Do you have any idea of the cost number? What’s that overhead going to be? It will be a separate layer.
Kevin Lyons
Year 1 it has to come in at the cost of providing services now. Whether it can be made cheaper and more efficient Year 2, or whether there’s an incredible demand for other things in Year 2….
Bill Echols
Just the fixed costs. The County overhead costs, not the service costs. So what’s the overhead for having a separate city?
Kevin Lyons
The overhead for a separate city…. It’s really interesting. There’s a lot of examples of recent cities—if you guys are interested in this—the [inaudible 1:03:35] area is really active for new cities. I’ve talked to a lot of people there, and studied some of the original ones. One of the more interesting ones was a city called Sandy Springs where they put up a government and just had one big contract for government services. So they basically had a City Manager to follow the details, and I think they also hired police, but they outsourced everything else. So at one extreme there’s like a manager and a bunch of contracts—and they evolved from there by the way. It was a straightforward way to get the city going – to sign multiple contracts and now they’re starting to hire in as it makes sense to do so. So there’s a range from that example, to contracting with some of the Washoe County services, maybe, or hire employees directly. All that stuff would have to be determined based on bidding and costs and everything else.
Denise Davis
On your FAQ don’t you have an explanation about—once we get enough signatures on the petition – then doesn’t the State have to do some kind of economic analysis?
Kevin Lyons
Yes, for the Committee for Local Government Taxation, that is one of their reports. They have to verify that there’s a tax base with an ability to pay for the services here locally. This is not an area where that’s an issue. [inaudible 1:05]
Todd Lowe
I think there’s a concern about the costs of independence. And there are 3 different ways to go. We already have a GID. It’s not a government. It’s got all kinds of staffing. The city can take it over in its entirety Day 1 so IVGID disappears on paper. Or the city could be as Kevin just described, one person. By law you have to have a treasurer and a judge and City Council, but that’s about it. That’s not a big number. But it could be just one person contracting for all other service providers we have today. That may or may not be the smartest idea, but that’s possible. Or there could be the 3rd option that is in between. I’ll just make something up. You say IVGID you’re now Parks and Recreation in the city government, as an example. But there’s a lot of variation. We need to hear from you and do more research and discovery to decide what’s best. We’ll bring the best forward and you’ll get a chance to weigh in.
Kevin Lyons
The petition is a petition to have a vote. So there will be a longer period of time after the petition for an actual vote, when presumably other details will begin to be filled in as we take the vote and decide to become a city.
Todd Lowe
There will be a negotiation with Washoe County. I’m sure there are some people from Washoe County here. The Village League has some experience working with Washoe County. So we’re looking forward to negotiating again.
Denise Davis
And if you want an idea of costs, the County already has contracts with the City of Reno and the City of Sparks for a lot of the services they provide. So we already have other contracts we can look at and say, “Well, this is what they’re charging them.”
Todd Lowe
We’ have a lot of homework. [inaudible 1:07] I think I mentioned this, that we are 100% volunteers. Nobody gets paid. [Anonymous – Just the lawyers.] Yes, for the professional services, I will pay the bills.
Andrew Whyman, MD
Speaking about professionals, do you need any mental health professionals?
Todd Lowe
Yes. [laughter]
Andrew Whyman, MD
This may go to a question about the powers of the city. We lived here for over 20 years, and one of the things I’ve noticed more than anything else is the workforce housing issue, or alternatively, world-class transportation to help folks who work here but can’t afford to live here. What power would a city have that the County doesn’t provide to make that happen?
Kevin Lyons
So I think I heard two questions there. The County doesn’t provide it. Is it not within their power? I think the answer is generally yes to those questions. And it’s also true in Nevada generally cities have power to do a wide variety of things that again serve the public as a whole. That’s the real main restriction.
Andrew Whyman, MD
Well what are things…
Kevin Lyons
Or we can just stick in a TTD person or out-of-towner who thinks it’s a great idea. The key thing as Todd mentioned earlier is that anything a government does should be solving a problem. It’s really that simple. If you’ve attended any CAB meetings, I feel like it’s the my theme, I keep asking, “What problem are we solving?” And there’s “crickets.” It’s way too easy to start from, “Hey, we need to do X. And everybody says yeah we need to do X.” “Yes that’s great, let’s do X.” Okay maybe. But what problem are we trying to solve by doing X? Does that solve X? And is that the most important problem in the community right now for the use of public resources? Maybe, maybe not—right? So you kind of back up to a logical flow of how to make public decisions, which is really important and what good governments do.
Todd Lowe
One of the things that is going to come up, and your question… I know we’re going to get a lot of questions about a specific concern, whether it’s dog parks, town centers, short-term rentals, whatever. “Are you going to solve that problem?” And our answer, and you’ll hear this a lot over the next couple of years, [inaudible 1:10:10] is probably we’re not going to solve that problem. But what we’re going to do is create a platform so that when you solve a problem, it’s going to be the solution that the community and you want. We’re bringing the platform, we’re bringing the ability, we’re bringing empowerment to do what we want for the community. If you’ve got an issue, that kind of tells us why we need to get together and craft local solutions to local problems.
Kevin Lyons
A local self-governing city is a problem-solving machine for public causes.
Todd Lowe
Everybody has got on their horse and gone to Reno and tried to get something done and failed or only partially succeeded.
Diane Becker – Citizen Advisory Board Chair, Ordinance 7 Committee member, Member of the Washoe General Manager Citizen Committee
First, thanks so much for all the work you’ve put in on behalf of the community so far on this. I have three questions. The first relates to the Beach deed. One of the things you mentioned in passing, Todd, is that IVGID could stay or it could go away. But without IVGID, I don’t think we could have the Beach deed. So I’m wondering if there’s some way you can assure anyone who is going to sign that petition who actually lives in Incline Village and is a beneficiary under the Beach deed, that the beaches will continue to be private for beneficiaries as set forth in the deed, maybe putting it in the City Charter? Is that a possibility?
Todd Lowe
Whatever the way it is, we’re going to provide it. We are not going to mess with the Beach deed. If that becomes the only purpose for IVGID, that’s what it will be. But we’re not going to mess with the Beach deed. Diane I don’t know the exact answer. Maybe given your credentials you’ll want to help us and join us to discover how we can do that best.
Is that a yes, Diane?
Diane Becker
Probably. I think the key on that issue is that so many people are talking about that, it’s important to put that issue to rest. So, thank you. Then my second question is, “Will whoever is the original mayor, city council, whoever is the governor, maybe the city manager, will that person be elected before the city takes over so they’re not designated?
Todd Lowe
The answer is yes.
Kevin Lyons
Yes, the initial election of officials is before the city takes over.
Todd Lowe
So be thinking about who you want to be mayor and who you want to be a City Council person. I’m not on the list.
Diane Becker
My third question is this. I haven’t been involved in looking at this approach, but I have seen—and this is all in California—when a county is formed or certain types of cities— and an allocable cost of the debt of the county and retirement plans has to be taken over. Is that going to have to be done by this type of city? I’m just curious.
Kevin Lyons
The answer is yes. That’s something that we’re looking into. For those of us who were here a long time ago, there was an effort to become a new county. The mention of Tahoe County earlier… I think it was called maybe Ponderosa County or something. A lot of what happened in that case was there had to be transfer of debts and liabilities and so on and so forth. It’s not clear that that has to happen in forming a city. There’s an area of the law that helps put some definition on it, where you have to equitably divide up the resources to provide the public services. Ultimately, Washoe County serves all the public in Washoe County. If the city would do those particular services for our area, so if the resources we need to serve the public, that’s part of it. If we benefit from something we haven’t paid for, you can imagine that would be part of that negotiation.
Todd Lowe
Yes, there will be a negotiation.
Diane Becker
That’s the end of my questions for now. Thank you so much for all the effort you’ve all put in.
Alex Tsigdinos – Incline Village Resident
I have a clarification and a question. First, just to make sure it’s clear in my mind, there are certain services we can choose to contract from Washoe County. So the big ones I’m thinking of are education, law enforcement, etc. We could either pay for that ourselves, or we could continue to have those so we wouldn’t lose law enforcement agents because they’re afraid of their pensions getting screwed up or something. That’s the first question. The second one is there’s obviously a lot of expense involved with this effort. I know you mentioned hiring professionals for this. But there also must be some transition costs. How would those be covered?
Todd Lowe
The Village League is covering the costs. When you go through the process of incorporation, you can actually tally up the cost, and the city can reimburse those. We do accept contributions, and that’s why we’re able to do this. Because there have been a lot of grateful people who have either just sent us their refunds or some portion of them. I can’t remember. It’s kind of a big number, so we’re well resourced. We won’t fail like prior efforts have for lack of funds.
Kevin Lyons
I just want to make a clarification about the schools. So the School District is a separate district. It’s called Washoe County School District, but it’s a completely separate organization, a district separate from Washoe County.
Todd Lowe
You might be aware that Washoe County and the school district are litigating each other as we speak [inaudible 1:16:50].
Jackie Chandler
I have three questions. One, since Truckee recently did this would it be to our advantage to talk with Truckee to see what happened when they split from their county, or have you already done that?
Todd Lowe
Yes. Not only that, but Fernley, Pahrump… we have a list. Maybe we should put the list on the website. It details Truckee’s failed attempts to incorporate and then their success. We do not want to make the mistakes that others have made either trying to do this or trying to do something else.
There are some volunteers. Myles Riner did a great write up on one of the attempts, and did an analysis for us. Thank you, Myles. Good job.
Kevin Lyons
We talked about that earlier in fact. Thanks, Myles.
Todd Lowe
If there’s a mistake or a [ ] that we shouldn’t use that someone else has done, that we can learn from, we are looking for all that input. We have people now going out and doing that research so we don’t make the same mistakes.
Kevin Lyons
To answer that question, there’s sort of a general rule. When those others Truckee and others had a failure on the first attempt, it tended to be like a local faction in town that had one thing that they wanted to push. They weren’t thinking in terms of a general community problem-solving machine. They were thinking, “Hey, we want X and we can’t do that right now but we can if we become a city.”
Jackie Chandler
I’ve noticed a lot of things are going on in Truckee since they have become a city. My other question is the TOT money. It’s been County money. Will that stay in the city? And my third question is will Crystal Bay be included?
Todd Lowe
I’ll answer the second question and Kevin will answer the first. I was just asked this by a Crystal Bay resident. Yes, Crystal Bay is included. We want Crystal Bay included. My opinion is that Crystal Bay would be somewhat foolhardy to not join—for them and for us too. So it will be one city. It will be called the City of Incline Village as we note on our FAQ. But you’ll still keep your Crystal Bay address because there is a post office there.
Kevin Lyons
Don’t hold me to this but I believe the Transient Occupancy Tax (TOT) gets thrown into the whole bucket with sales taxes and all the other taxes, called consolidated taxes. And that makes up almost half of the Washoe County budget, much like the property tax. I think combined they equal 84% of the total taxes.
Denise Davis
I believe the TOT pays off a lot of the RSCVA debt like for the Bowling Stadium and other projects like that. The County gets about $100K a year from TOT, which is what visitors pay when they rent a hotel room including STRs. So right now the County gets $100K from collection of that tax. They consider that not very much and not worth worrying about. We have often asked, well can we have our 9% of the TOT, and they say they spend it on us.
Kevin Lyons
Are all line items allocated that way? Or does any of it go into the General Consolidated fund?
Denise Davis
They call it going into the General Fund for the County. And the County says they only end up with about $100,000. Many millions of dollars go to pay off debts. I’m not sure when all of those bonds end, but that’s the bulk of what I believe 13% tax on a room is.
Jacquie Chandler
So would we as a city get the TOT? This is a huge amount of money.
Kevin Lyons
Why not?
Denise Davis
It’s only $100,000 Jacquie, what would we do with that?
Ray Tulloch – Incline Village Resident, Candidate for IVGID Trustee
Thanks Denise, and thank you Todd and Kevin. I’m Ray Tulloch, 15 year resident and candidate for IVGID Board of trustees. First of all I want to thank you for this. The
concept is great. The problem is that at the moment we are trying to be all things to all people. I really think you need to quantify what the vision is and put some meat into it very quickly.
As full disclosure, as part of my professional background I’ve been involved in a number of mergers and acquisitions, and the transition plans to do that. The work is very much in the transition and working out the details. Don’t underestimate the scale of that; and don’t underestimate the cost of that.
I think the biggest fear in the community is duplication. I’ve heard it said the only duplication will be 5 extra cancelled people and IVGID will still run in the background. That’s totally unrealistic. The last thing we want is for two Finance departments, two directors of Finance, two HR departments, two IT departments in a village of 10,000 people. It makes absolutely no economic sense. I think we need to quantify very quickly what the transition is to that so we don’t duplicate costs.
I think also in terms of property taxes. Well I think we need to bear in mind that people need to be out front. About 35% of our property taxes go to Washoe County School District (WCSD). The other taxes will still go to Washoe County. That leaves our share of property taxes that will then be allocated or dictated by the city as a relatively small proportion. So let’s be very clear about that up front. Let’s put some outline of numbers right now out front so people can understand what we’re talking about. I think now—no offense guys—it’s wonderful it’s la-la land—it’s everything everyone wants. I think we need to be very clear before we get the petition. We need a much clearer vision of where we are. I don’t think we have that at the moment. That’s the disturbing factor. I listen to the community. At a function on Tuesday night just after your FAQ came out, I managed to actually piss off both sides—those who wanted the city and those who didn’t. So let’s bear in mind to be clear. I understand that at this stage you want to keep everyone on board. But at some stage you’ve got to come out with a clear vision of what you actually want.
I think also I’ll add a shameless plug. Assuming this moves forward and I expect it to, this is going to put a huge impact on the IVGID Board of Trustees as well. I think it’s absolutely important that Trustees have professional experience in doing these transitions and of negotiating deals and mergers. So I’ll make a shameless plug. There’s one candidate who has that professional experience. Please bear that in mind when you’re voting.
Todd Lowe
[inaudible 1:24:25] The last thing we want to do is to shake things so hard that we disrupt community services, the quality of service, or the people who provide the service.
Ray Tulloch
Yes, you have to keep the community services going. You have to keep the lights on.
Todd Lowe
So we can’t be disruptive. And then the request I make to you besides signing up to volunteer and contribute all your good experience, is let’s not speculate on what the numbers are. Let us do the homework. Let us produce something. Then give us your comment. We need to read the numbers without [ ].
Kevin Lyons
And you’re right by the way. Just so people are clear, the Washoe County share of property tax—you see the breakdown on your tax bill every year—is 41% of your property tax. It’s not even a majority. Number 2 is WCSD, which gets 33%. So between the two, that’s 74%.
Don Morrison – Incline Village Resident
Don Morrison, Jack Pine Lane for 25 years. I’ve been following all these efforts for 25 years. I remember the last effort or an effort about that time. It was all approved for Ponderosa County. The State Legislature approved it. And the Democratic governor vetoed it because he did not want an elite school district in Incline Village. The last effort I believe was 10 or 12 years ago. It was determined by the people who were doing the work—Jim Clark and Ed Gurowitz were still involved in that and I hope you have consulted with them—the last effort determined that a city was absolutely not the right way to go, because Incline Village doesn’t have enough people or voters to support a city. It ultimately went to a referendum to see whether we would continue to pursue a town or township, because a town or township can still contract for police and fire and other services they might not be able to afford to establish themselves. I’m not a naysayer. I’ve been following this for 25 years, and something sure needs to happen around here because we’re being steamrolled by Washoe County continuously. But I’m not sure a city is the right way to go, because the city is required to provide everything. A gentleman talked earlier about contracting out for police and fire. I don’t believe a city can do that. Thank you.
Kevin Lyons
There’s a lot to say to that one. Thanks for your support Don. Again, thanks to Myles for the report. I think that was only the School District that was vetoed. There may have been a separate effort. But you just highlighted the challenges of going through the Legislature. All I want to say is we’ve gone that route.
Don Morrison
It was a separate county.
Kevin Lyons
It was a separate county, which is how you get a separate school district. That’s how you lose.
So in 2008, I don’t know the reasoning behind it, but the idea was to expand IVGID into an unincorporated town. That was shot down. People didn’t like the idea of giving IVGID more services and more responsibilities. That’s a different approach. The process this time did look at all the options from doing nothing, to doing some kind of contracting with Washoe County, to becoming an unincorporated town, to an incorporated town, to doing a city, to becoming our own county.
To solve the problems —again to focus on what are the problems people have—I still want to do the speed rap if anyone wants to stick around—but the problems that keep coming up especially in the last 5 years—as an 18 year resident—they are things that a township wouldn’t solve, and that a city would have the problem-solving ability to solve.
Todd Lowe
We are talking to Jim and he has some great memories and some [1:29 inaudible]. And if the numbers show it’s not viable, which I doubt [1:29 inaudible] we won’t go forward.
Barbara Perlman Whyman – NV Tahoe Conservation District National Board President
We’ve lived here almost 30 years on the same cul de sac as Maryanne Ingemanson, and go back to [inaudible 1:30] and getting things done with all of your input. What I really want to say is for the last 18 years I’ve been elected by 3 counties as the supervisor for the NV Tahoe Conservation District. I served as president, I served as president of the State of Nevada, and served on the Boards for many years representing all of us in Washington and on national boards, and as president of all the United States and territories for all conservation. It brings me to the points that were made, since I also can assume the mantel of leadership—to Jacquie’s concerns in terms of our environment, which includes the human and natural environment. What Steve has talked about… Our District has won many best-in-basin awards, including the entire realignment of 3rd Creek where [ ] and we live. We look at those issues and we look at Crystal Bay and take care of a lot of the problems, and we can solve some of those problems. But we also have to deal with the fact that we represent 3 counties: Carson, Douglas, and Washoe. All of them are supposed to contribute to our budget. It’s interesting because Washoe County initially contributed. We were part of their budget and they were expected to pay in because we did the services. When things got bad around 2006-2007, we did them a favor. We allowed them not to make a contribution. The second year they came back and made the same plea. Every county contributes and they have to send their representatives [1:33 inaudible] that stopped. And nothing’s happening also here. We waited 10 years [1:33 inaudible to 1:36]
Denise Davis
We’re going to lose our livestream in a minute.
Todd Lowe
When it comes to interacting with other bodies outside of Incline Village, as a city that’s so much more—a higher station. We don’t have the ability to go out and request funds or attention from anybody because we are just a GID. As a city, some of the things—and it sounds like you’ve done an awful lot of work—we can do more if we choose. We’ll have a better platform, a higher station, more authority, and more control, and more responsibility.
Denise Davis
Okay, we need to move on. Judy Miller can you put your question in the Chat real quick? And John can you ask your question really quickly?
Jon Fuhrman – Incline Village Resident
Yes I can. As I understand it municipalities and counties in Nevada are not allowed to restrict recreational facilities and parks to residents only. So as I understand it, if the city were to get control of the beaches, we would lose the ability to restrict access to just property owners.
Kevin Lyons
That is our assumption also, which is why we won’t touch that.
Judy Miller
I put a question in the Chat so I don’t know if you’ve been able to take that. But it’s NRS 318.492, which says, “the county shall issue a resolution for merger” of a GID with a new city. And the only way that would not happen is if the majority of property owners file a protest to that action.
Kevin Lyons
That’s almost correct. It actually depends on the boundaries. If the boundary is completely encircled, then it’s automatically merged. If not, then it isn’t. There’s an option there.
Todd Lowe
We still get our choice depending on how we set the boundaries.
Judy Miller
Then it won’t be the GID boundary? I understood it was to encompass all of the current GID.
Kevin Lyons
We haven’t decided.
Yolanda Knaak – Incline Village Resident, Candidate for IVGID Trustee
I’m Yolanda Knaak. I’m also a candidate for IVGID. I want to thank you for all your hard work. I’ve been saying for years, we have taxation without representation because people who represent us from the County live down the mountain. So a city would solve this problem. I hope you can work out all the details with the situation with IVGID and becoming a city. And thank you so much.
Rick McBurnett – Incline Village Resident
I’ve been in Incline Village for 29 years. I want to ask a question that I think will allay a lot of fears. If we had been a city could we have written our own short-term rental guidelines?
Todd Lowe
His question was if we were our own city, could we have written our own STR guidelines. The answer is yes.
Rick McBurnett
That’s a huge positive for becoming a city because our real estate people went down and we have the worst STR department in the whole Basin.
Todd Lowe
Okay, so that’s your opinion. I don’t say whether I agree or disagree with it. But I want to repeat something I said before. From a city platform we could have done that. And whatever we wanted we could do that. But this initiative isn’t about any one issue.
Rick McBurnett
I just wanted to use that as an example of where a city would have really helped.
Todd Lowe
The number of such examples is a lot.
Denise Davis
If you’re not aware, the City of Reno and City of Sparks don’t have to follow the County STR regulations, because they are their own entities. The County rules only apply to everything outside the City of Reno and Sparks [Kevin Lyons – Unincorporated areas].
Rick McBurnett
I’ve also heard we give more money to Washoe than we get back. [1:41:07 inaudible]
Kevin Lyons
There was a recent presentation on that. We have 2% of the population in Washoe County, 5% of the parcels, and pay 9% of the property tax. That doesn’t talk about sales tax, consolidate tax, or any of that [ ] .
Todd Lowe
And there is a report saying that they provide us more—they pay more for our services—than we give them. Which I love, because then I say, “We’ll take it.” We’ll take all of it and see what we do with the services.
Phil Michaels – Incline Village Resident
I want to piggyback on that question about a city being able to write its own rules. Would we have been able to change the outcome of the mobility center if we’d been a city versus basically having it shoved down our throats by the County?
Todd Lowe
First off, that’s a complicated situation. [1:45:15 inaudible]
Phil Michaels
Okay, and my 2nd question and you touched on this, have you had any preliminary discussions with Washoe County about this, and were they indifferent or vehemently opposed? And kind of the same question for IVGID itself. You hinted at it but didn’t really answer.
Todd Lowe
Yes, with certain officials in Washoe County we have had some discussions. There have been some discussions. There should be more. I would love it if they could find a way to fully support this. Do I expect it? Maybe not. But I think they should. We’re not making Washoe County go away. We’ll still be a part of Washoe County. So this isn’t about ditching Washoe County. It’s about gaining some autonomy and local control. If they either can’t or won’t [1:43:17 inaudible].
Kevin Lyons
We’re kind of an act if we’re only 2 % of the population.
Todd Lowe
We’re geographically and socially disparate from the rest. It’s so obvious. We’re 9000 [1:43:35 inaudible] in the forest, which is landlocked and lake-locked too. And we’re different. [1:43:49 inaudible]
Phil Michaels
And the same question for IVGID. Did you talk with them? Do they care?
Todd Lowe
Yes, we have talked to every single trustee and the General Manager [1:44 inaudible]
Phil Michaels
And are they for it?
Todd Lowe
Do you want me to say?
Phil Michaels
Absolutely.
Todd Lowe
[1:44 inaudible] They’re on our side. They have concerns but they are 100% for it.
Rhiny Moeller – Incline Village Resident
Thank you for a great job. Just one question, if Incline becomes a city— are chances better or worse for getting State and Government grants?
Todd Lowe
We can’t get government grants now. That’s basically [1:45 inaudible]. So for example, the American Rescue Plan Act (ARPA) funds, I guess [ ] got some. But if you talk to Indra, we got zero ARPA money. IVGID got zero ARPA money. [Denise Davis – Because it went to the County]. [Kevin Lyons – Cities and counties.] As a city we could have raised our hands and said we would like some of that too.
Reiny Moeller
So as a city our chances are better?
Todd Lowe
Way better. Infinitely better. It’s like “no way” to “whatever you may ask.”
Kathie Julian
Has somebody looked at the relationship with TRPA? Specifically you’ve said that the city will still be part of the County. And when TRPA makes decisions that then the County says we need to be consistent with TRPA, how would that work in the context of our being a city.
Todd Lowe
TRPA doesn’t go away. It is inescapable. We have to comply with all. However, I would argue –and this is my opinion, which is the way I feel. And I’ve been working with TRPA. You may also know that I’m the President of the Lake Tahoe Lakefront Owners Association, which includes 5 counties and 2 states all the way around the lake. So I’ve had a long life with TRPA. I think someone from Incline Village should be our representative on the TRPA Governing Board. And why not? We are on the lake. And there are other things that TRPA hasn’t done which we used to have. We use to have a Washoe County designated planner supporting us. That’s gone. As a city, again we’re going to have an elevated station and we can improve our relationship in working with TRPA so it aligns more with our needs and they understand our needs better. They won’t be asking someone who lives 35 miles to an hour away. That’s my opinion. That’s the way I’d love to see us go. And actually it’s one of the things about this initiative that excites me a lot.
Denise Davis
All right. Any final questions?
John Crockett
We have one in the Chat. And Todd, Ronda cannot hear you when you turn away from the mike. So one in the Chat is from Eric. “There are a number of services that the County currently provides that may benefit from efficiencies of scale (that they have and we wouldn’t). How and when does the analysis of these kind of things occur in this process?”
Todd Lowe
That’s a good question and Kevin’s going to answer it.
Kevin Lyons
Yes, that’s one of the reasons cities especially in California where there is a huge movement for Contract Cities – where they find a reason to actually contract where that matters whether it’s scale and how they can tap into that, and they can actually increase the scale a little bit by being a participant in a multijurisdictional contract. The timing in which that happens would be when the new city itself has to sign contracts. Because it would be great for us to do bidding and sign contracts and stuff. There’s some set up before that when the elected officials can actually start getting a jump on that. Think of it as taking effect at 12:01am on July 1st. Think of it as happening at the latter end of the process… if that’s helpful.
Todd Lowe
Also, consider that if we’re “sole-sourcing” any of our services from Washoe County, once you’re a city, they would have to compete against alternatives the city could reach out and embrace. What are you going to charge us? We’ll take the best bid.
Kevin Lyons
And make sure we’re getting the services we want at the price we want to pay.
Alex Tsigdinos
I really just want to make a comment for those people who live here like myself who have come from much larger states. I’ve heard a lot of people say, “Well we’re too small to incorporate.” But just look at the census data. We are actually as is the 25th largest town in NV. We’re bigger than Winnemucca. We’re bigger than Fernley. We’re bigger than West Wendover.
Todd Lowe
We’re bigger than 7 counties. And our GDP would make us #3 in the State.
By NV standards we are not small.
Alex Tsigdinos
I think that’s a really important point. So the people who move here from California who say we’re too small to do this, etc. By Nevada standards, we’re not small.
Todd Lowe
We’re not small.
Kevin Lyons
Most cities in the US are less than 5000. The median is around 2000. So we’re pretty good. We’re in good shape.
Todd Lowe
We’ve gone on a long time. So maybe the thing to do is wrap up. And Denise you can invite us back. We’ll come back and bring more of the people who volunteered to talk on their specialties.
John Crockett
What is the best way to contact you or ask a question?
Todd Lowe
So you know we have a website. We’ve got an email address. The website has a mechanism where you can put in your name, your email, you can write something. We will respond to every input. So if you ask a question, you can expect to see an answer. One of the reasons this is going to succeed like we want it to is because we are going to be communicating effectively and broadly and transparently throughout the entire process. And right now our website is where you need to go to get the benefit of that. But we’ll come back here. I think we’ll probably have some big kickoff thing at the Chateau. There’s a lot in store. But we just started. That’s the thing to recognize. We’ve just started. It’s not a short journey, but we’ll move along as quickly as we can.
Denise Davis
All right. Thanks Todd. It was great to see everyone today. We are working on having some in-person candidate forums after Labor Day. Our next Community Forum meeting will be the first Friday in August, August 5th. Please join us again. Please sign up for our emails. If you did not get an email about today’s meeting, make sure we have your email address. And we are adjourned. Thanks.
CHAT BOX
Myles Riner MD to Everyone (9:01 AM)
please go on mute unless you plan to speak
kathie julian to Everyone (9:10 AM)
Correction, I moved to Board of Adjustment, not Equalization. Thanks
Washoe County Libraries to Everyone (9:10 AM)
https://tahoe-transportation-plan-washoe.hub.arcgis.com/
Washoe County Transportation Plan Survey deadline extended
Jacquie Chandler to Everyone (9:19 AM)
to learn more about Beavers – HIGHLY RECOMMEND: https://vimeo.com/146629773
Leave it to Beavers
IVGID Communications to Everyone (9:28 AM)
– UC Davis partnership Lake Tahoe science summer Camp next week is available.
– Next board of trustees meeting July 27
– LOW WATER ADVISORY: Due to low water levels, launching boats longer than 24ft is not permitted at the Ski Beach Boat Launch.
– Incline open tennis and pickle ball tournament
I’m unable to stay connected today for some reason.
Myles Riner MD to Everyone (9:39 AM)
How do you respond to residents who have expressed concern about adding another layer of government to the current County plus IVGID government layers?
Rob H to Everyone (9:42 AM)
What are the key issues that this is hopefully going to solve? How is this city going to be funded? How much will this cost us as homeowners?
Jacquie Chandler to Everyone (9:42 AM)
Would this city replace IVGD?
Could the City of Incline reset STR rules? Transit rules? Would the City now pay for our own bus service> TOT money would stay in Incline?
Washoe County Libraries to Me (Direct Message) (9:54 AM)
Ronda, we’re going to go past 10.
*keep going past
IVGID Communications to Everyone (9:57 AM)
Camp links. https://www.yourtahoeplace.com/parks-recreation/programs/day-camps.org
I’m unable to stay connected today for some reason.
Washoe County Libraries to Everyone (9:58 AM)
Thank you Kari! We’ll give a shout out at the end of the meeting.
IVGID Communications to Everyone (10:00 AM)
Watercraft launching info: https://www.yourtahoeplace.com/parks-recreation/outdoor-recreation/watercraft-information
IVGID Communications to Everyone (10:00 AM)
Tennis and pickleball events: https://www.yourtahoeplace.com/parks-recreation/tennis-center/specials
Sara Schmitz to Everyone (10:01 AM)
The county has been reducing the money being spent on our community, which means we will need to increase taxes to deliver the services the county isn’t.
IVGID Communications to Everyone (10:01 AM)
Board of Trustees Meetings Info: https://www.yourtahoeplace.com/ivgid/board-of-trustees/meetings-and-agendas
IVCBA (Incline Village Crystal Bay Community and Business Association)
Aaron Vanderpool to Everyone (10:10 AM)
For the record. I’m less interested in creating workforce housing and more interested in preventing it from disappearing.
kathie julian to Everyone (10:11 AM)
Agree
Sharon Dally to Everyone (10:15 AM)
I know I’m in the minority, but I would hate to see the City of Incline formally discriminate against residents who do not currently have beach access.
Eric to Everyone (10:16 AM)
There are a number of services that the county currently provides that may benefit from efficiencies of scale (that they have and we wouldn’t). How and when does the analysis of these kinds of things occur – in this process?
Washoe County Libraries to Everyone (10:19 AM)
Mr. Morrison, I see you have your hand raised to speak.
Me to Washoe County Libraries (Direct Message) (10:31 AM)
Denise – When Todd turns from the mike I can’t hear what he says….
Washoe County Libraries to Me (Direct Message) (10:32 AM)
Got it, Ronda.
Me to Washoe County Libraries (Direct Message) (10:34 AM)
Can’t understand Barb Whyman at all…
Jacquie Chandler to Everyone (10:34 AM)
its very hard to hear Barbara after you did something to the recording or mic?
Jon Fuhrman to Everyone (10:35 AM)
Is there a time limit on comments?
Washoe County Libraries to Everyone (10:35 AM)
There is, 3 minutes.
Jon Fuhrman to Everyone (10:35 AM)
We are well beyond that.
pupfarm’s iPhone to Everyone (10:36 AM)
Nrs318.482 calls for a GID to merge with a city unless the majority of property owners protest.
Washoe County Libraries to Everyone (10:51 AM)
next meeting August 5 at 9 am
Washoe County Libraries to Everyone (10:55 AM)
our email is: ivcbcommunityforum@gmail.com
Tahoe Transportation Plan survey (Washoe County mobility project)
deadline extended to July 22
https://tahoe-transportation-plan-washoe.hub.arcgis.com/
Community Emergency Response Team (CERT) training begins July 21
Washoe County Sheriff Office (WCSO)
non-emergency dispatch 775-785-9276
SR 431 and SR 28 road construction info
TRPA July 21 Hearings Officer meeting agenda
TRPA July 27 Governing Board meeting agenda
Legislative Committee for the Review and Oversight of the Tahoe Regional Planning Agency and the Marlette Lake
Water System
July 15 meeting agenda
https://www.leg.state.nv.us/App/InterimCommittee/REL/Document/27927
TTD Commission Board Aug 3 meeting
IV mobility committee July 25 meeting
Washoe County Libraries to Everyone (10:55 AM)
IV mobility committee July 25 meeting
https://www.inclinevillagemobilityhub.org/
Board of County Commissioners (BCC) general info
www.washoecounty.gov/bcc/board_committees/index.php
BCC July 19 agenda
Washoe County Leadership Academy – deadline to apply is Aug 1
https://www.washoecounty.gov/WCLA/
county test program – road construction mapping
https://gis.washoecounty.us/wrms/quick/roadprojects
https://www.washoecounty.gov/csd/engineering_capitalprojects/Traffic%20and%20Roads/index.php
IV/CB Citizens Advisory Board (CAB) agenda for Aug 1, 2022
https://www.washoecounty.gov/CABS/IVCB_CAB/index.php
2022 Lake Tahoe Summit – Aug 16
IVGID Board of Trustees (BOT) July 27 meeting agenda
Washoe County Libraries to Everyone (10:55 AM)
IVGID Board of Trustees (BOT) July 27 meeting agenda
https://www.yourtahoeplace.com/ivgid/board-of-trustees/meetings-and-agendas
Village League “City of Incline Village” website
https://www.cityofinclinevillage.com/
IV/CB Community 1st meetings and community info
IVCBA (Incline Village Crystal Bay Community and Business Association)
STEVE DOLAN INPUT:
Video: Beaver Bob
He’s Incline and Crystal Bay’s new wilderness firefighter, water quality engineer, and wetlands manager.
He just arrived this spring at the heart of our watershed.
He’s about 2 years old and freshly cast from his parent’s lodge deep in the wilderness
Healthy, about 45lbs, and is doing his work; building dams for our environment, fire safety, and water clarity.
Brief history: Last summer the US forest service Lake Tahoe Basin Management Unit literally sucked the stream and this pond dry by its illegal syphoning off of the meadow springs —post Old Incline Lake dam removal. The emerging meadow is now known as Seven Springs Meadow. Apparently, the gully washer late October flushed the forest service dam-work dregs from 3rd Creek, refilled the Seven Springs Meadow branch of 3rd creek, and as a result flushed and filled this pond too. Because of the combination of the drought and last summer’s artesian-spring syphoning, the creek could not recover until October’s super storm. NDOW-fisheries is infuriated by the LTBMU’s theft from the meadow’s springs.
This beaver, and its new home is again threatened by actions that may mirror last year’s illegal artesian spring syphoning. This summer/fall Seven Springs Meadow will be “restored” because over the last 5 years nature didn’t do it the way the US forest service wants it done.
Seven Springs Meadow is one of the most beautiful meadows I’ve ever walked through. Three years ago, long time Incline resident & Environmental Biologist, Mr. Richard Thall, and I lay on our bellies admiring the rarely observed first-phase birth of this new Seven Springs Meadow. We were inspecting five-petal flowers an 1/8th of an inch in diameter, less than ½ an inch tall, which were wrapped in primal, nurturing mycelium, as they clung to the newly evolving lakebed soil. We marveled at grass so fine that it looked more like fog as it hovered low in the meadow, and from it, stronger grasses burst forth in clumps two feet above this moisture preserving fog-grass. Tall and light beige with a purple hue, to the eye this grass looked to be adorn with pin-sharp mohawks, by touch they are as soft as mink.
In the fall when the naturally growing grasses turn to every shade of gold and brown, flowers blue, purple, firetruck read and sunlight yellow nestle close to those artesian springs and subtly blend their color into fall’s golden glory. These flowers remain, committed to the bees, deer, rabbits, bobcats and bears until buried in the autumn snow.
The US Forest service wants to make this meadow better… In the process they plan to dig up the first stages of evolution for this meadow. Unaddressed, they may suck dry and plan to artificially divert the natural confluence that these springs have created to join 3rd Creek. In the process they will dryup the downstream creek and ponds that our new resident beaver was invited to: by the very agency of its demise.
Call the LTBMU with your concerns at (530) 543-2600.
We are the Friends of Third Creek and my name is Dolan (775) 843-7244
PARTICIPANTS
Aaron Vanderpool
Alex Tsigdinos
Andrew Whyman, MD
Barbara Perlman-Whyman
Barry Bale
Beth and Jon Davidson
Bill Echols
Bill Rozak
Bruce Simonian
Bruce Townsend
Carolyn
Chris Wood
Cliff Dobler
Denise Davis
Diane Becker
DK
Edie Farrell
Emily
Eric
Glen Bartlett
Greg Juhl
Greg McKay
Helen Neff
I Phone kat
Jacquie Chandler
Janet Lowe
Jill Brandin
Joe Farrell
John Crockett
Jon Fuhrman
Joseph Colacurcio
Judith B Morrison
Judy Miller
Kari Ferguson
Kathie Julian
Kevin Lyons
Kurt
Laine Fuller
Laurie Bartlett
Linda Offerdahl
Lynette Cardinale
Mike Young
Myles Riner, MD
Patrick McBurnett
Paul
Phil Michaels
Ray Tulloch
Reinhild Moeller
Rob H
Ronda Tycer
Russell Barnum
Ryan Sommers
San Levine
Sara Schmitz
Scott
Sharon Dally
Shirley Appel
Steve Berg
Steve Dolan
Steven Sesma
Svata Trossen
Tia Rancourt
Todd Lowe
Trudi Adam
Yolanda Knaak
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